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Millet Citruholic
Joined: 13 Nov 2005 Posts: 6657 Location: Colorado
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Posted: Wed 07 Nov, 2012 6:41 pm |
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Thank you for your response, but you answered a question with a question. Therefore, I must ask once again can you provide a confirmation showing that your Italy statement is indeed correct. - Millet |
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Sanguinello Gest
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Posted: Wed 07 Nov, 2012 6:58 pm |
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yes, it is known since the 15 th century and decribed in all old citrus books.
same in my links ...
Copied from the link above :
LAT Citrus × aurantium 'Abers Narrow Leaf'
Syn
Abers Narrow Leaf is an extremely narrow-leaved form of sour orange The tree is small and drooping in habit and the fruit is typical of bitter orange except that the calyx is fleshy. The presumption is that Abers Narrow Leaf originated in Florida, where it received its name, though it may have been an introduction.
In appearance it somewhat resembles the Granito and the Willowleaf variety, but is not identical with either one.
Abers is much used for the extraction of essential oil from its leaves.
ENG Abers Narrow Leaf sour orange
FRA
Photo © Gene Lester
LAT Citrus × aurantium 'Willowleaf'
Syn
Citrus × aurantium var. salicifolia
In their famous treatise of 1818 Risso and Poiteau published a picture and a description of a Bigaradier à feuilles de saule, a sour orange with willow-like narrow leaves. This variety is reported to have originated in 18th century Italy.
Willowleaf is an ornamental sour orange. The tree is moderately dwarfed, of highly symmetrical round-topped form, with dense compact foliage consisting of small, narrow, sharp-pointed, yellowish-green leaves. Fruit is small, round to pyriform, yellowish orange and about one third to half of normal sour orange size. Rind thick and rough. Pulp yellow, sour; few seeds. The juice is very acid and somewhat bitter.
Only one clone of Willowleaf has been noted in California and its origin and history are unknown, although it is believed to have been introduced under the botanical variety name salicifolia. It is markedly different from Abers which has sometimes been called Willowleaf.
Willowleaf forms grow true from seed.
ENG Willowleaf sour orange |
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Laaz Site Owner
Joined: 12 Nov 2005 Posts: 5671 Location: Dorchester County, South Carolina
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Posted: Wed 07 Nov, 2012 7:00 pm |
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It is markedly different from Abers which has sometimes been called Willowleaf _________________ Wal-Mart a great place to buy cheap plastic crap ! http://walmartwatch.com/ ...
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Sanguinello Gest
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Posted: Wed 07 Nov, 2012 7:02 pm |
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The link before showed all about ABERS ...
To let you see both I both copied now in the post before ... |
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Millet Citruholic
Joined: 13 Nov 2005 Posts: 6657 Location: Colorado
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Posted: Wed 07 Nov, 2012 9:59 pm |
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Sanguinello, thank you again. It looks like some think that Abers might have originated in Florida, but it seems that no one knows for 100 percent sure where the actual origin site was. - Millet |
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Sanguinello Gest
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Posted: Wed 07 Nov, 2012 10:11 pm |
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OK, now just what I think/know :
Abers and Willowleaf are same, just different clones.
Both Abers and Varia are ancient European varities. |
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Millet Citruholic
Joined: 13 Nov 2005 Posts: 6657 Location: Colorado
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Posted: Thu 08 Nov, 2012 12:43 am |
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Well let us agree to disagree. Albers is definitely different. But feel free to think/know whatever you wish. - Millet |
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Radoslav Moderator
Joined: 03 May 2008 Posts: 454 Location: Slovak Republic
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Posted: Thu 08 Nov, 2012 4:35 am |
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One thing is for sure, Varia is sweet orange and Abers is sour orange - theoretically Abers can be seedling of Varia and fruit lost it sweetness, like wild orange in Curacao lost sweetness of its ancestors, and now are used to produce famous drink. I can not speak about the USA, but for sure, one and only known source of Varia in Europe is Mr. Peter Broza - and he got it from one man, who got it many years ago from Italy, Mr. Cernoch who has nursery, got it from Mr. Broza and sell it to some countries in the Europe and also Russia . But noone can say more! Because even original source in Italy is right now totally unknown. All other is only guessing or divination from glass ball. And Varia is really extremly different plant, man can not just put it in one bag with others and say - it is willowleaf.
BTW: I never saw two types of leaves (like Abers has) on Varia plant.
and I think that Laaz´s plant is Varia not Abers. |
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grad85 Moderator
Joined: 15 Aug 2010 Posts: 224 Location: Eindhoven , Holland /Barcelona Spain
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Posted: Thu 08 Nov, 2012 5:12 pm |
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Just took some fruit of my little willowleaf.
They taste like mandarin but with a bitter taste,not dry at all.
Also very easy to peel.
Tomorrow ill take a shot off the hole plant.
I took a small nespresso cup next to it, so you see how big/small they are _________________ Grad
<a |
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grad85 Moderator
Joined: 15 Aug 2010 Posts: 224 Location: Eindhoven , Holland /Barcelona Spain
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Posted: Fri 09 Nov, 2012 7:47 am |
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_________________ Grad
<a |
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Laaz Site Owner
Joined: 12 Nov 2005 Posts: 5671 Location: Dorchester County, South Carolina
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Posted: Fri 09 Nov, 2012 11:41 am |
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Interesting, my tree doesn't have any of the wide leaves and the fruit is more oblong. _________________ Wal-Mart a great place to buy cheap plastic crap ! http://walmartwatch.com/ ...
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Radoslav Moderator
Joined: 03 May 2008 Posts: 454 Location: Slovak Republic
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Posted: Fri 09 Nov, 2012 12:22 pm |
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As I remember right, grad85 has citrus aurantium var. Salicifolia (latin word for Willowleaf).
As for Varia:
Mr. Broza said (he has collection of ancient citrus books, huge collection of citrus varieties and have visited all famous collections in Italy and many in another european countries), that he has no clue, what citrus sinensis "Varia" is (except, that it is sweet, small fruited orange) and where to localize origin of this plant. He did not find anything a like there. |
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grad85 Moderator
Joined: 15 Aug 2010 Posts: 224 Location: Eindhoven , Holland /Barcelona Spain
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Posted: Fri 09 Nov, 2012 1:12 pm |
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Yes mine is Citrus aurantium var. Salicifolia aka Willowleaf. _________________ Grad
<a |
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Laaz Site Owner
Joined: 12 Nov 2005 Posts: 5671 Location: Dorchester County, South Carolina
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Posted: Fri 09 Nov, 2012 1:27 pm |
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So, one may be a budsport of the other? Very confusing... I will have twp of these plants available at the expo for anyone interested. _________________ Wal-Mart a great place to buy cheap plastic crap ! http://walmartwatch.com/ ...
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Radoslav Moderator
Joined: 03 May 2008 Posts: 454 Location: Slovak Republic
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Posted: Fri 09 Nov, 2012 1:52 pm |
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May be there is one thing which can help to distinguish Abers and Salicifolia on the one side and Varia on the other. All three have some extremly narrow leaves. But when you look closely on the leaf, Abers and Salicifolia have simple sharp end. Varia has something like V cut on the end of the leaf and then it looks like double end.
Good test for distinguish nearly identical looking citrus trees is also test of the smell of crushed leaf. I do not have Salicifolia or Abers plant right here, so I can not compare it right now. |
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