hello all,
I'm new to the site though I've lurked for a little while. I recognize a few names from around the net. My name is Ethan, I live in Bakersfield CA, it is part of the central vallley. We grow lots of crops here including lots of citrus. I never really gave growing citrus much thought, it was always available from others. For fun I started calmodin and yuzu from seeds, needing info on these fruits is how I found this site.

A combination of seeing JoeReal's grafting tutorial and spying fruiting sized calmodins at the local box store brought me to my question.

What would be the best citrus tree to purchase with the intent of grafting multiples to it later. I would prefer a dwarf sized tree and I like all the citrus I've tried so far. I dont need to compete with Joe for most variety grafting-records but it would be nice to have 5 more citrus on one tree eventually. Your thoughts?

thanks for your input,
-Ethan
sorry should have posted in "in ground citrus forum", obviously new here.

Welcome to the forum Ethan,
I'm not really an expert, but have been following this forum for almost a year and have learned a lot. I think the experts will tell you that Lisbon lemons are at least one variety that is known for taking a wide variety of other citrus grafts. Millet did say when I asked about lemons as rootstock that they almost always reduce the quality of the varieties that are grafted to them-- I do not know if that applies to lemon as an interstock. Apparently, lemon rootstock is so vigerous that it causes the fruit to grow and produce more juice, but it is not as sweet or flavorful as it would be on other rootstocks.

I have somewhere around 8 to 10 varieties on my Lisbon lemon now and would like to add some more.

Skeeter you are using Lisbon lemon as a rootstock in your zone ? I would worry about a cold snap killing it off.

It is not the rootstock-- it is the interstock on my cocktail tree. I think the rootstock is trifoliata.

It did not have any problems with the temps we had (the lowest was 26 F) until that last freeze after it had started to flush--Then the part that I could not cover (one limb that sticks straight up about 8 ft) had all of the new tender growth and blossom buds killed-- the part I covered with the frost blanket was just fine.

If a lemon diminishes the flavor of other citrus grafted to it, would finding the sweetest orange and using it as interstock, increase the flavor? Are there oranges as graft compatable as Lisbons?

thanks again,
-Ethan

This last weekend, I planted my new citrus. I went with a morro blood orange and a calmodin. The neighbor nextdoor has valencia orange, one accross the alley has navel, so I went with blood. I am planning to do a sweet grafted tree (blood orange) and a sour (calmodin). I also picked up a frederick passionfruit to replace the one that died (nematodes or frost?). This one will stay in a pot.

-Ethan

Hi Ethan,
I'm not an expert on the effects of grafting on various rootstocks, but I can tell you that the primary commercial rootstocks are chosen more for their ability to handle soil types and resist disease. Flying dragon is used for dwarfing because it is slow growing. I believe that the reason for the lower quality fruit on lemon is because it induces a vigerous growth and a higher juice content (with less flavor). There are some incompatibilities, but not many.

Trifoliata used as a rootstock will produce excellent quality fruit. Trifoliata imparts it's hardiness on the scion as well. Flying Dragon is the dwarf variety of Trifoliata... The one citrus that I know of that is not compatible with Trifoliata is Eureka lemon. Most other citrus will produce excellent quality fruit on Trifoliata.

thanks for the info gentlemen,

the citrus I purchased was from Four Winds(?) they were labeled as "true dwarf citrus". I assume this means they were grafted onto one of the rootstocks you mentioned. If it is trifoliata rootstock would an interstock of calamondin allow Eureka to be grafted?

thanks again,
-Ethan

I never opened this thread til now because of the title.

Here's my notes on this topic:

Maximizing Number of Fruiting Cultivars
•Use vigorous rootstock, semi-dwarfing to standard

Good Rootstocks for multi-graft: C-35, Troyer, Volkameriana, most citrange hybrids, other trifoliate
Not recommended for multi-graft: Flying Dragon trifoliate. Remember we are maximizing number of cultivars in this context, although you can definitely use this, it would be slower and poor takers when doing multiple cultivars as it is designed as dwarfing stock, and so characteristic of slow growing.

•Use base cultivar that develop sparse to moderate branching. Base cultivar is the main cultivar directly grafted unto the rootstock and is the one which will support your multiple cultivars
–Good Cultivars:

Oranges (Navels, Valencias, Pigmented)- are usually very good to graft to.
Lemons (Eurekas, Lisbons, Meyers, Other Lemons) –generally, lemons like the lisbon are compatible with the most number of citruses and always have vigorous strong sprouts that are ideal to graft to. But take note that some lemons can interact and lower the taste quality or oranges and mandarins. If you simply want to have many kinds of fruits and can live with a little bit sub-par taste, then lemons are good for you.
Some Grapefruits (Melogold, Chandler, Oro Blanco) – to a certain extent, grapefruits and pummelos can also lower quality of oranges and mandarins. Some grapefruit hybrids are also readily compatible with a very wide range of cultivars, and sometimes are used as rootstocks themselves.
Satsumas (Owari, Miho Wase) – while spreading, are generally slow growers and harder to graft to (slightly fewer takes), but be patient.

–Not Recommended (numerous sprouts and dense canopies, but you can use them nonetheless if you really wanted to):

Some Mandarins (Page, Clementines, Ponkan)
Some Grapefruits and Pummelos (Chironja, Mato Buntan)

•Make Sure that each cultivar will get a piece of the sun each day.

•Planning can span multiple years

Start grafting at the North Facing Canopy, going to the South when multi-year work

•Same year grafts

Vigorous Cultivars grafted on the north side and slow growers towards the south side
Those grafted in the east and west should have the same vigor and moderate between those grafted in the north and south side

Maximizing Cold Hardiness
Take advantage of adding cultivars vertically. The main idea here is that you form natural frost blanket on the top canopy. Frosts starts at the top of the canopy. So arrange the grafts when vertically possible in the tips below. Also, by arranging vertically, it would be within easy reach to protect the cold sensitive cultivars when freezing temperatures are forecasted to stay longer.

•Cold hardiest cultivars in the top canopy
•Moderate hardiness in the middle canopy
•Most cold sensitive cultivars in the bottom canopy

General Guide from Top to Bottom of canopy

•Sudachi, Yuzu, Kinkoji, Ten Degree Tangerine
•Kumquats, Mandarinquats, Calamondins and other Fortunella Hybrids
•Mandarins: Satsumas, Clementines
•Oranges: Valencias, Navels (Navelina one of the cold hardiest)
•Pigmented Oranges
•Tangelos and Tangors
•Pummelos and Grapefruits, Meyer Lemons
•Lemons: Lisbons, Variegated and Regular Eurekas
•Limes, Bergamot, Citrons, Kaffir

Remember, my kaffir Lime survived the arctic blast without a scratch. The Lisbon base has no problem at all handling the arctic blast. But of course, I did some extra protections within my resources in the yard and kitchen tools.

Balancing Multi-Grafted Trees

•Regraft slow growing cultivars over the vigorous cultivars.
•Take advantage of water sprouts, if they are growing in direction of opening in the canopy, graft unto them your slow growing cultivars as they will most likely be vigorous on those sprouts.
•Good canopy balance can be achieved in just 2 to 3 regrafting cycles, if you stopped adding cultivars.

My Favorite Grafting Methods For Multi-Grafted trees
All of these grafting methods have very high success rates on citruses when done at the proper time. The general tip is that citruses are budded whenever the maximum temperature is above 60 deg F to 90 deg F. That happens during spring and Fall. Don’t do grafting when it is raining, it will lower your success rates as the water drippings carry diseases and dirt unto the open wounds while you are working. High humidity will transport fungal spores. Do not graft when there is an extended forecast of hot temperatures those that exceed 95 deg F. Between 90 and 95 deg F, there are things you can do like shielding with aluminum foil to minimize heat load. Here are my favorite grafting methods that I use to allow me to graft almost year round.

•T-Budding

–Fastest method to do. At first this is overwhelming for a beginner, but with much practice, this saves a lot of time and quite easy to do.
–Minimum scionwood material. One viable bud is all you need to add a cultivar but increase chances of successfully adding a cultivar by doing more than one T-bud
–Bark must be slipping. Prune destination branches 2 to 3 weeks prior to T-budding if bark is not slipping.
–Applicable when trees are younger and have plenty of vigorous growth.
–Quite hard to force the T-bud sprouts on a mature tree branch if you allow your tree to have fruits and blooms.

•Chip-Budding

–Slowest method to do, matching cuts are difficult especially for a beginner. Budwood must be covered completely with parafilm to prevent moisture loss.
–Also minimum scionwood material. But you can increase chances of successfully adding a cultivar by doing more than one
–Can be done earlier, just before the bark slips, or whenever the barks are not slipping. Ideal for late winter when you have no more frosts but the citruses are still dormant and you have obtained budwoods already. For example, The University of California Riverside Citrus Clonal Protection Program have their first budwood cutting in January. Adding the cultivar earlier frees you up for more critical activities later in the season. Sometimes there are extended warm spells in the middle of winter and you can do citrus chip budding at that time to. Best to do in the late fall and late winter. But when the bark slips, switch over to T-budding, it is way faster and has the same success rate.

•Bark Grafting

–Easiest method to do. Highest Success Rate especially for a beginner. Slower to do than T-budding, but way lot easier if you’re a beginner.
–More vigorous growth on Multi-grafted trees. Sometimes T-buds or Chip buds would remain dormant and can’t sprout on multi-grafted trees, the bark grafting method overcomes this problem and rarely will not sprout. It will either die or sprout, but never remain in suspended animation like what can happen to T-buds or Chip buds on multi-grafted trees.
–Bark must be slipping. But sometimes very forgiving. As long as you open and lift the bark flaps with a bread knife or any dull knife and not damaging the bark flaps, then you can do bark grafting at that time
–Requires a lot of scionwood material, a whole budstick per graft
–If somebody gave you budsticks that are too angular, or small and not suited for T-budding, you can use it for bark grafting.
–Disproportionately big diameter destination branches OK. You can do bark grafting on the same diameter as your budstick, up to several times its size. If the destination branch is really big, budding will not work, and this is your best option. As long as you can open the bark and insert a properly prepare budstick, that’s the only thing required. So you have more choices to graft to on the destination tree.
–Increase chances of successfully adding a cultivar by doing a T-bud combo if you have extra time. When bark grafting, most likely you will cut off one viable bud at the bottom end of the stick, and instead of throwing that away, use that for T-budding, then do your bark grafting above the T-bud.

Ethan,

I would strongly recommend that you use Volckameriana rootstock. You can buy them from TreeSource Citrus nursery at just $1.00 per seedling. I usually buy a dozen or more to distribute the shipping load, then I give the extra seedlings away as gifts, grafted already of course. Volckameriana rootstock especially in California are excellent for multi-grafts and produce the highest yield and fruit quality at par with Flying Dragon. Of course, Volck is not a dwarfing type as you can't achieve highest yield with a small tree in the same area of land.

Joe

wow Joe,

thanks for all the wonderful information so succinct and all in one spot. Definitely a bookmark page.

While Im not trying to achieve the type of trees you have(multi multi grafts), I would like 4 or 5 in one and consider it a success. People around me have various citrus trees growing, so I have access to lots of stock for grafting. My fear is of disease, am I justified in my fears of apparently healthy trees? If so, not wanting to be a begger, could someone reccomend a source for clean budwood to purchase?

thanks everyone for their help,
-Ethan

(sorry for the ambiguous title Joe)