I wanted poncirus trifoliata old enough to produce fruit for seed and didn't want to wait for a seedling to start producing so I grafted one on swingle, I just noticed this week that it grew huge last year compared to seedlings from the same tree. Has anyone tried this before! I know it is pointless But I am amazed by it's growth.

Why do you feel this procedure is pointless?

Dealing with selected out cutting grown rootstocks
in Maples from grafted parents we found that the
rooted cutting individuals made better rootstocks
than either parent did. In other words take a red
palmatum graft it onto either a red or green seedling
and then take softwood cuttings from the put together
plants and use those rooted cuttings as a proprietary
rootstock for grafting. Or in some cases, better yet,
let those rooted cutting plants set seed and use
those “improved” seedlings as a foundation
rootstock.

If I were to work on it, I'd graft Troyer and Carrizo
onto Flying Dragon and take cuttings from those
put together plants, root them, grow them on and
eventually select out a rootstock that we could
use as a seed parent rootstock for here.

In various woody plants, grafting, not budding,
onto parent rootstocks speeds up the time the
newly put together tree will bloom and set seed.
We can speed up the blooming process in Cornus
florida as an example by at least five years just
by grafting onto select seedling rootstock. We
can also take a red or pink Cornus florida graft
it onto a white Cornus florida seedling rootstock,
root cuttings from that grafted plant and also
speed up the time it will take to see those
rooted cutting plants bloom.

What I am getting at is if you want to see
Poncirus trifoliata bloom and fruit earlier
than a seedling plant of it normally would,
then graft or bud it onto a Swingle rootstock.
Take cuttings from those progeny plants,
grow those rooted cuttings on and wait less
time to have what you want.

Far from being pointless from my experience.
To be candid, some of the best seedling
rootstocks for Yulan Magnolias and Cornus
kousa grafting were derived in this same
manner of grafting two parent lines onto
each other, rooting cuttings from those
grafted plants and then letting those
cutting grown stock plants go to seed
and end up with a universal seedling
rootstock.

Jim

I wonder how poncirus trifoliata grafted onto sour orange rootstock would affect the length of the trifoliata dormacy period? It would certainly make sense to me that it would reduce the dormacy period (like trifoliata roostock increases the dormacy period for citrus), thus increasing the growth rate and decreasing the juvenile period.

Grafting Trifoliata onto Sour Orange has been
done before. As far as lengthening or shortening
the "dormant" period that I do not know as of this
writing. Not sure that was the reason why those
original grafts were conducted. Sometimes grafts
were made to see if the two woods were compatible.
Grafts were made to introduce vigor into the proposed
cultivar clone plant as well to use as a standalone plant,
test plant or as a projected rootstock. In the olden
days people did not graft or bud plants because it
was the only methods of propagation they knew
how to do. Years ago there was a reason for the
propagator to graft or bud and in most instances
it was to enhance vigor into the scion plant by
way of the rootstock. We can incorporate into
the scion plant cold resistance by using a single
grafting or budding to help things out (Lindcove).

Generally, there was no need to graft Trifoliata
onto Sour Orange in areas that have known
Tristeza issues but the reverse is more so
true that Sour Orange like Seville was grafted
onto Trifoliata. Mostly Citrange to impart
some measure of dwarfiness, okay I'll bite
here, a slowing down of the stem and lateral
elongation, as well as add in some cold
tolerance into the Orange. Trifoliata and
Citrange rootstocks did not always take
well for some propagators with Seville
scions and grow well as trees later on in
some areas. Mostly kept as a collection
plant, landscape and/or novelty tree for
most people that have Seville or once did
have them.

I have never owned the variegated
Seville but my next door neighbor
has a Seville that was grafted, not
budded, onto Swingle Citrumello
that I found for them from a nursery
friend back in the mid 80's. Their
Seville does sweeten up, astringent
to my palate until the fruit is fully
mature, ripe to me, and then is
rather edible. The zest from a
Seville is quite good in confections.

Something I must add here is that
I believe it when people say that a
Swingle as a standalone tree will
grow taller than if Swingle was
used as a rootstock. I've also
seen it whereby two trees side
by side, one that lost its scion
budded clone years ago due to
the Swingle over taking it and the
same Orange in which Swingle
is its grafted rootstock parent,
that there is a marked disparity
in size of the Swingle rootstock
Orange tree compared to the
Swingle tree. The Swingle tree
of the same age as the Orange
tree is much larger than the
grafted Orange tree is. The
12' tall reference is about right
for the Swingle tree (actually
a large bush, no single trunk),
the Orange is at best 8' tall in
comparison in one of my other
neighbors yard. Considering
the age of the Swingle at the
time of the takeover it certainly
has grown at a faster rate than
the Orange has.

Jim

this is our fast growing trifoliata grafted on Swingle
it was grafted 13 months ago.


sorry we can not make the pic bigger


Hershell.

i grafted a piece of pt onto a pomelo seedling and it has grown way faster than the piece i grafted to a lime. it is just now breaking dromancy but the one grafted to lime showns no signs of breaking dormancy i did the original graft for the same reason you did making something grow faster has to reduce the time to fruiting. i cannot compair the results becasue the original seedling of the pt died.i was on vacation and the person that was supposed to water did not pay attention to the wind blowing some of the plants over. before it died the seedling was growing way slower than the grafted one to pomelo. the one on lime i need to graft to something else and cut it off the lime. hopefully i will get some fruit within the next few years for seeds for rootstock. i wish i had recorded when i grafted the plant that way i would have know how long it will take to fruit from grafting time