Citrus Growers Forum

dauben · Posted: Tue 14 Dec, 2010 11:34 pm

'Was in the mid '80's here this week. Next week we become Seattle with showers every day. Thursday night dips down to 32 though. 'Must be global climate change.

Phillip

viktor · Posted: Wed 15 Dec, 2010 12:16 am

I use large bags made out of house wrap to save my trees from the cold. The bags go over a steel 4'X4'X16' frame I made out of 1/2" pipe. To keep it warm inside the frame I use several candles, which I leave burning overnight.

frank_zone5.5 · Posted: Wed 15 Dec, 2010 9:50 pm

an idea I stole from Millet is to have black barrels/gallons of water around the trees, during the day they will heat up to some extent and given off the heat at night..... Since you guys are "marginally " cold this may help a lot

Frank

wd40 · Citruholic Joined: 10 Dec 2010 Posts: 105

It is interesting to see how the volume of the enclosure determines how much heat is needed. My Myer is a bit over a 1000 cubic ft. It takes a bunch of lights. My pineapple enclosure is about 100 cu ft and two sets of c9 will kept it 50F when it was 20F outside.

I had not thought of using the house wrap. Niffty idea. Did you hand sew that?

Randy

JoeReal · Posted: Thu 16 Dec, 2010 7:12 pm

dauben wrote:

'Was in the mid '80's here this week. Next week we become Seattle with showers every day. Thursday night dips down to 32 though. 'Must be global climate change.

Phillip

Could be a lot worse than global climate change. San Diego was once wrapped with thick layer of ice. So I won't be surprised anymore.

JoeReal · Posted: Thu 16 Dec, 2010 7:15 pm

viktor wrote:

I use large bags made out of house wrap to save my trees from the cold. The bags go over a steel 4'X4'X16' frame I made out of 1/2" pipe. To keep it warm inside the frame I use several candles, which I leave burning overnight.

All will be fine until the occassional 20-60 mph wind that always visits us every winter, to clean the last remaining leaves on the deciduous trees.

We need to batten down and secure every huge enclosures. Greenhouses should be wind resistant to 75 mph.

JoeReal · Posted: Thu 16 Dec, 2010 7:18 pm

wd40 wrote:

It is interesting to see how the volume of the enclosure determines how much heat is needed. My Myer is a bit over a 1000 cubic ft. It takes a bunch of lights. My pineapple enclosure is about 100 cu ft and two sets of c9 will kept it 50F when it was 20F outside.

I had not thought of using the house wrap. Niffty idea. Did you hand sew that?

Randy

While more heat is needed for bigger volume, heating would be much more efficient per unit volume. It is the surface area to volume ratio that can play a big factor on your heating efficiency. Smaller greenhouses are more expensive to heat on a per unit volume basis than large greenhouses.

TRI · Posted: Sun 19 Dec, 2010 1:19 am

Anyone here suffer damage in the January 1982 freeze? The temperatures here dropped to all time record lows for the month of January near 12F. The low temperature duration was very long and all citrus was killed. That freeze wiped out all unprotected citrus even before the 1983 freeze or 1989 freeze event. The pressure in the center of this arctic air mass was an all time record high! In the 1980s there were three very severe freezes: January 1982,December 1983, and December 1989.

Is it even possible to protect citrus when temperatures drop that low? I would like to save the top of the plants but in very extreme freezes the soil bank is the only reliable protection.

I am going to move to Florida City south of Miami and never worry about freezes again. That is a great place to grow plants without worry of extreme severe freezes!

JoeReal · Posted: Tue 21 Dec, 2010 12:23 am

TRI wrote:

Anyone here suffer damage in the January 1982 freeze? The temperatures here dropped to all time record lows for the month of January near 12F. The low temperature duration was very long and all citrus was killed. That freeze wiped out all unprotected citrus even before the 1983 freeze or 1989 freeze event. The pressure in the center of this arctic air mass was an all time record high! In the 1980s there were three very severe freezes: January 1982,December 1983, and December 1989.

Is it even possible to protect citrus when temperatures drop that low? I would like to save the top of the plants but in very extreme freezes the soil bank is the only reliable protection.

I am going to move to Florida City south of Miami and never worry about freezes again. That is a great place to grow plants without worry of extreme severe freezes!

Another new problem would be citrus greening, other tropical diseases and plenty of quarantine. But goodluck!

Millet · Posted: Tue 21 Dec, 2010 1:06 am

I am not sure about the area south of Miami, but in my estimation, Miami, could possibly be the worst place in the America to live, with Los Angeles would be a close second. - Millet (755-)

Darkman · Posted: Tue 21 Dec, 2010 2:12 am

Millet wrote:

I am not sure about the area south of Miami, but in my estimation, Miami, could possibly be the worst place in the America to live, with Los Angeles would be a close second. - Millet (755-)

Yeah I don't want to live anywhere where the snakes weigh more than me! Very Happy

_________________
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Life - Some assembly required, As is no warranty, Batteries not included, Instructions shipped separately and are frequently wrong!

Kentucky Bourbon - It may not solve the problem but it helps to make it tolerable!

TRI · Posted: Wed 22 Dec, 2010 4:06 am

I do not think we have to worry about freezes in January because the jet stream is going to pull way up into Canada allowing milder air to return. The block should weaken in the second week of January.

ivica · Posted: Wed 22 Dec, 2010 7:55 am

TRI wrote:

I do not think we have to worry about freezes in January because the jet stream is going to pull way up into Canada allowing milder air to return. The block should weaken in the second week of January.

That seems to be good bet, supported by NAO index:
http://www.realclimate.org/wp-content/uploads/naoi-djfm.png

http://www.cpc.noaa.gov/products/precip/CWlink/pna/month_nao_index.shtml

http://www.cpc.noaa.gov/products/precip/CWlink/pna/nao_index.html

Seems reasonably to expect NAO flipping to positive side.
However, we'll see how it goes in a few weeks. Polar Vortex is on the move from Siberian side toward Canadian arhipelago. Eventual split of Vortex (early January) could result in a dipole effect and weaken jet stream what is not good for us.

End of the year could be unpleasant for citrus in Georgia and Carolines according to projections Nr. 10..14 from
http://www.westwind.ch/?link=gfsm,http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rhavn,.gif,122,242,362,482,602,722,842,962,1082,1202,1322,1442,1562,1682,1802

_________________

TRI · Posted: Sat 01 Jan, 2011 2:20 am

It looks like a severe freeze is possible in mid January. The NAO has been negative for most of the past year now and now looks like it will be even more negative in mid to late January. I will do everything I can to fight this freeze but if I fail, might consider persimmons and figs.

Some very cold air is forecast to build in Northwest Canada in the second week of January and move down to the northern plains and midwest and from there it will spread out! Chicago may have a day or more with highs below 0F! The core and worst of this cold air mass may stay far north, but I will build my banks soon!

Northwest Canada is the source region for most of the major freezes in the last 200 years.

Millet · Posted: Sat 01 Jan, 2011 4:16 am

Here in Colorado tonight it is currently -5F (-20 C), a good way to end 2010. My greenhouse heaters have been running all day. Ski Colorado. - Millet (745-)