I just found out that Florida homeowners are limited to 39 trees, otherwise they have to get a commercal license. I was rapidly approaching that limit with over 20 counting all the tiny seedlings I have just started.

I guess I will have to control my addiction.

-- Skeet

Skeet, up until this post I thought I had heard of EVERY POSSIBLE stupid, if not profoundly abysmal law, but I have to hand it to Florida's Department of Agricultural, as they have come up with a real GEM. A commerical licence should be required for regulating the growing of Citrus for resale to the public or wholesale to packers/shippers or canners. This law sounds more like something out of the ACLU. Come to Colorado where your FREE to grow as many trees as you have room for. -Millet

Or Californiaee!

Does that count all trees including ornamentals or only fruit trees, or only citrus trees?

I have technically 45 planting holes for all of my trees but 355 cultivars growing on them.

Out of the 45 planting holes, I have only 10 citruses but 80 or more citrus cultivars growing on them, and on one tree, I have 51 cultivars, will I be in violation if my yard is in Florida?

Skeet, on second thought Benny is right. move to California rather than Colorado. California needs more people. - Millet

If I'm richer, I would move to Colorado, where it has the best city to live, and by then would be able (afford) to build greenhouses that can accomodate the best tropical fruits I dream about including citruses.

Our current lot is so small that I can't squeeze in another plant, and takes me more than a week to decide where to squeeze in a new cultivar to graft. So much for California being big....

Thanks Guys-- I may be up for a move soon anyway if hurricanes keep getting worse and insurance keeps going up!

I found out about the limit of 39 trees from FL budwood program when I asked about the limit of 40 budeyes for homeowners. I think it is directed at nursery operations more than production, but it was not clear whether it applied to inground or container plants or both. I definitly dont think they count varieties on individual trees-- otherwise I would be over the limit with my recent budding!

I will still be growing my limit to give away to family and friends-- no intentions of selling any.

Skeet

Skeeter
How much is the license? There may be some benefits to having the license. Some insecticides and herbicides can not be purchased without a commercial license. You may get some discounts on fertilizer, purchase of more trees etc.

I wonder if they do actualy Count Seedlings?

Or Perhaps they Treat Seedlings like Puppies and Kittens. When they talk about the Limit of Pets you can have, they do not count Puppies and kittens until they are 4 months old, Perhaps they do not count seedlings until they are 2 years old, or until they start producing flowers (Would that be teenager seedlings or Seedlets?)

I asked the lady at FL DPI, but did't get a clear answer on what they count. The limit is directed at nurseries and I don't think they actually check homeowners unless they have some reason to believe that they are growing citrus for profit.

-- Skeet

Whether one considers it reasonable or fair, it is true that Florida citrus is not the first agricultural entity to have such rules in place. Here, as well as in most other states, one cannot possess a bee hive unless one is registered with the state, and on the list for regular inspections. Most of the beekeeping industry as well as hobbyist apiarists, consider this a good thing, keeping down the spread of pests and diseases from the neighbors. I think that's the idea with citrus as well -- the potential for loss is so huge, that it is considered a lesser evil to get the government involved, than to leave everyone to himself.

Dr. Manners, I understand what you are saying. However, the state of affairs that the Florida Citrus Industry finds itself in, which could, and more than likely will get worse in the future, is not founded on residents having 39+ trees. I don't think that a Florida resident having 40 citrus trees instead of 39 citrus trees is the cause of the dilemma that the industry is facing. Anyway, we all certainly hope and pray for the very best possible outcome for Florida Citrus. BTW, I am no longer able to find in any store, Florida Orange Juice with the "Florida Citrus Tree" emblem on the container. Is there no longer 100 percent grown, squeezed and processed Florida product? Is all juice now Florida/Brazilan, or Mexican?- Millet

Certainly, residents with 40 trees are not the "cause" of our industry's problems. But almost all of the nasties (greening, canker, severe tristeza, etc.) that we're dealing with WERE smuggled into the state by non-commercial residents, who simply had to have a cutting of grandma's tree from Jamaica, or Punjab, or some other part of the world, and so they smuggled it home in a suitcase. Same is true for almost all citrus insects. There are exceedingly few known cases in which it was a commercial grower who introduced a new pest or disease (Diaprepes weevil was brought in by commercial tropical foliage growers, and citrus ringspot virus was brought from Texas on illegal budwood of 'Star Ruby' grapefruit, but those are the only two examples I can think of).

On the other hand, when a contagious disease is moving around within the state, the regulatory people have to have some concept of where it is coming from and where it is going. And while I certainly do not always agree with the DPI or its policies, I see the 39 rule as a very (VERY) large loophole for all but the largest of hobbyist growers, trying to be nice to the backyard gardener, rather than forcing every single tree in the state to be regulated at the commercial level. By setting the limit at 39, they've made 99.999% of the backyard gardeners happy.

And I know there are those who say it is not reasonable to bother backyard gardeners to protect the commercial interests -- that they don't care about commercial citrus. The problem there is that, perhaps more than any other crop or state (except perhaps corn in Nebraska or wheat in Kansas), Florida's economy would be massively damaged if that one crop were to disappear over a period of less than several decades. Everyone would be affected deleteriously. So there is always that very difficult balancing act -- what are the individual's rights, when the individual could cost the rest of us billions by an unwise behavior?

I don't know whether the Department of Citrus is still using the Sunshine Tree emblem or not. But certainly, all "not-from-concentrate pure premium" juice coming from Florida processors is still 100% Florida grown. I buy it from Florida's Natural; Tropicana also makes their own version of it. And I believe all juice packaged in the US must state a country of origin somewhere on the label. the premium packs will say "Ingredients: 100% Florida-Grown Orange Juice," or similar wording. I just now looked at the carton of Florida's Natural in my refrigerator, and it does not seem to have a sunshine tree anywhere on it. But it does state that it is 100% Florida juice.

Malcolm

Florida will have to adapt or perish. People should learn how to accept the inevitable. It is inevitable that diseases would severely damage the citrus industry. It is also untrue that all citruses will be wiped out.

From the very start of the citrus industry, and the rapid transport due to commerce, and even the dusts carried across continents, insects, pollens and viruses riding on the jet stream across the atlantic, offloading it in the US, so it was just a matter of time before these diseases and pests would erode the profitability of citruses, even in California. There is nothing in this world that can stop that from happening, even if draconian laws with death penalty were to be carried out on all violators. Case in point was the futility of citrus canker eradication program. It was a complete failure, but has to be done, because something has to be done, a total waste of money. It would have been well spent on research for cultivar resistance or developing better citrus varieties.

The world's climate is changing to favor the increase of pest and diseases where it was not present before, and so Arizona, Texas and California citrus industries will be impacted, in just a matter of time, perhaps not in my lifetime. We have to race towards developing resistant cultivars if we cannot move the citruses. Even in the worst case where the citrus industry collapse, citruses will not be wiped out completely, may not be profitable, but still nice to have in your backyard.

Quarantine helps delay, but not prevent. We can slow down or reverse man-made climate change, but I believe we have tipped beyond immediate repair and so will have to bear the consequences before it will get any better.

I'd like the US to spend more on citrus research in the changing climate and disease resistance.

I'd like to see any improvement on the research to stop global warming before it is too late.
I don't want to see earth to be like mars or moon landscape without water or vegetation.
Man did it and Man should undo it.