Hi everyone.

I was wondering how the best way to go about choosing varieties is.

Obviously I am reading about the varieties you all have, but many of you guys have much better climates and facilities than I have in my London apartment. So I need to think about varieties that not only taste good but have a decent chance of ripening here.

I am hoping to go to the places Eddie mentioned, as I can get to them all fairly resonably, but I would really like to have a good chance at getting pleasant fruit as well as beautiful plants. They will be kept in the flat and I will make whatever sacrifices re heating etc that I have to to keep them happy. Hopefully we will be moving in a couple of years and I will have a garden for them in summer and I can wheel them out in their pots. So I am thinking abut conditions now nd in the future.

Does anybody recommend a reference for finding out which varieties have a good chance, or is word of mouth best? Although my lemon sprouts are all doing very well I would like to get a lemon that is closer to fruiting or already fruiting. My mother had a meyor that fruited well in the sixties in a London flat, so maybe thats a good idea? And I suppose, I would like to think about some table fruit, maderins or oranges or even grapefruits...is there a pink grapefruit that would have a chance here?

I am sorry to be so hapless, I know these are really basic questions, but if you could point me in the right direction for a book or something...!

I am also enjoying reading the "Other fruit" forum here, as my parents have always grown fruit trees (apples, pears, cherries, plums, greengages and soft fruits) but I showed the more tropical things to my husband who just raised his eyebrows, and seeing I am so new to it all I am going to be prudent and stick to the citrus for a while!

Maybe I was wrong, but I decided to get whatever it was I wanted. My trees will be indoors probably 9 months out of the year. we get hot and humid, but, in winter my trees wont get as much light as I would have hoped... so, I've purchased several grow lights for them.

I know citrus takes heat and humidity to ripen and sweeten. I think even without as much as they would like, most citrus would be good, but I'm strange, I love the sour, bitter taste of most the sour citrus. I eat lemons as if they were oranges. mmmmm

I think I would go with what YOU want and work from there. best way to go!

Lulu:

Have you perused this site, which is in the UK?

[url] http://www.homecitrusgrowers.co.uk/home.html [/url]

There is information on varieties and cultural advice.
(I reduced the size of my browser's font and it displays
better.)

Let me try that again, without spaces.

http://www.homecitrusgrowers.co.uk/home.html

Thanks Tomm, yes I have found that site....the person is a member here too.....his site is extraordinarily inspiring but his knowledge and facilities are so massive that I hesitate to asssume that if he grows things I can!

Betty, thats a good way to choose varieies I guess! Only I am so inspired by all the varieties people have mentioned that it is hard to cut choice down. I am starting to filter through googlesearch and love the sound of the Pink Lemonade lemon and Gold Nugget mandarin, but have seen people here rave about the Honey....and perhaps a Moro in Oranges (I seem to be going through a girly pink stage!) and although I usually eat pink grapefruits I have seen the Oroblanco highly recommended for flavour........who can choose!!!!

it really IS hard to narrow down. Luckily, I can put mine outside fully during the summer (unless is pouring like it is now) so I can have a few more trees than ou. I have a feeling I'll soon be sleeping outside in my tent with all the trees I want. heh.

I have a great collection, variety already... but OH so many more I MUST have... now if I get my way... it'll be the tent for me But... my trees are worth it!

Hi Lulu,

I live in Fleet, Hampshire, UK. It's about 45 miles west of London down the M3

Have you tried these sites:-

http://www.citruscentre.co.uk/index.html

This one is in Sussex. Has a lot of varieties, growing courses and some useful info. Owned by a couple who gave up their jobs in the city. Has a premium rate helpline but you can get help by e-mail if you don't do it too often. He is very helpful and gives good advice. She is very abrubt and not so helpful. Their trees are very expensive, £75 for a decent size. But if you can afford 1 or 2 and then take your own from them it's worth it as they are good trees.

http://www.globalorangegroves.co.uk/

This one is cheaper - £35 for a 4ft tree. Most imported from Spain. Usually get new stock at beginning of June. Not so commercial. But if you can get advice from the owner, she's good but isn't so set up for giving advice. Worth a visit. The nursery is near Bournemouth. Has a book - some good stuff on growing but a lot about what else you can do with Citrus.

Other souces but not specialists:-

Bushtrees@aol.com
info@crosscommonnursery.co.uk>
www.crosscommonnursery.co.uk

I'll try and remember some others.

I have a small garden so not much room and it doesn't really get enough Sun either, even in Summer. My trees are outside from end May to late September (but not yet cos of all this rain! Can't believe we have a hosepipe ban?!) Most are in a lean-to greenhouse in winter with a fan heater. So it's not the ideal conditions for growing.

I've lost one Lime and had problems with another but a good amount of fruit. Seems I'm learning with Limes but they are tricky in the conditions I have. Seem to like it a bit hotter than other varieties which is difficult.

I have a Washington Navel, bought from Global Orange Groves that seems hardier to colder/harsher conditions. Managed to get some fruit last year and it's been growing like mad in the last month

Eureka and Verna lemons are a good bet as well.

I've heard Ruby grapefruit don't ripen well here. Just not enough Sun and heat for long enough even in South facing places.

I want to see if I can get any success with Satumas if I can think of a space to keep them??!

Hope this helps

Nick

Thanks for the UK based advice Nick!

I know Fleet......well Fleet services, my family home is in Somerset so I get to spend a lot of time on the M3/A303!

I am hoping to visit Global Oranges during this summer, when I'll be in Somerset so the drive will be shorter. I also remember vaguley that when I was a kid my parents and I went to a citrus nursey in Chesington (as in World of Adventures) and I hope to see if that still exicts, after visiting the nursey Eddie spoke about which is not too far away. I am I think, going to have to miss this growing season, and buy something at the end of summer, but I can dream until then can't i!

It is REALLY helpful to talk to other peole from UK about what works for them variety wise, I will almost certainly want to discuss this more as I get closer to making y first real investment in plants....!



BTW I thnk the hosepipe ban is related not just to weather but the population shift to the South/ south East. Thats why there is plantey of water in the South West and north of the commuter counties. Our letter from the watr company was obscurly referring to it as well as the dry summers and it certainly make sense. Our flat is the top two floors of an Edwardian town house built for one family......now there are four flats, four times the water use. Not good.

Think this is the Chessington one:-

http://www.chessingtongarden.co.uk/

but I couldn't find what they have got on the website.

Another source is:-

http://www.saalfelds.freeserve.co.uk/PlantSources.htm

If you are down Somerset way and feel like a drive, Cross Common Nursery in Cornwall (possibly in Truro) looks to have a good selection. They are helpful with advice on e-mail as well.

http://www.crosscommonnursery.co.uk/plantshop_list.asp?ptid=36


Anyway, good luck - let me know how it goes

Nick

Forgot to say, Global Orange Groves sell Citrus compost that has worked very well for me. It's seems to have the right consistency for drainage and watering as opposed to some of the more bark based compost some advise. The stuff from Global Orange Groves seems to be good for Oranges and Lemons and I wish I had it in my limes as I nearly lost one that is in Bark based compost as due to the conditions I have the pot and compost was retaining water too much and getting cold. The roots didn't like this as Limes tolerate the cold less being a more tropical variety.

Been to Global Orange Groves twice and it's one massive glasshouse although the owner was starting to build another last Summer.

She imports new trees from Spain each year which I think come in the 1st 2 weeks of June (but check when they arrive as she might be doing a show round this time as well) Has lots of various other age trees but most are over 3ft tall.

She's very knowledgeable and I probably trust her advice more than most and has given me advice that has worked well in the past. Not that forthcoming when you meet her but very good via e-mail or phone as long as you don't take the mick and contact her too often. She isn't all out to get your money in whatever way like some. By the way, don't think she takes credit cards (damn!). I got caught out by this the first time I bought there and she let me take the trees and send a cheque.

It's in a lovely part of the world with some great pubs nearby which is always a bonus!! Easy to get to from M27/Bournemouth road or could get there from the A303.

Nick

Good to hear such good experiences. I did email Global Orange groves but had a different experience to yours (said that I could not grow citrus indoors, they would die).

But I am keen to go and have a look. Thanks for the Chessington info!

I was also very interested in your recommendaion of the GOG compost. I will definitely get some. I mixed up my own for the two seedlings from tiny expensive "London" bags of compost as I only really have room for one big sack of compost. My seedlings are justt in general purpose compost but I will pot them into the other stuff. I'll go at the end of June I think.

I think people do grow Citrus in doors but mainly in Conservatories. I've heard that you can but haven't tried it. Would love to have space/money to have a Conservatory and try it.

From what I understand you have to be very careful with the conditions. Citrus don't like sudden changes in conditions e.g. bringing them from outside into a centrally heated room. They also like to be well ventalated and kept away from Radiators. Humidity is also a factor but you can do things like spray the leaves with water etc. So difficult in Winter. But if you've a sunny light windowsill or space by a patio door away from radiators I'd definately give it a go.

So perhaps she means it's more tricky and it's not a natural environment but then isn't that a problem if you keep them outside - we are all trying to recreate a Mediterranean climate where trees grow outside in the ground.

Please don't let it put you off. A lot of people seem to do it and I am sure there are people on this site who do and can give you plenty of tips.

I've found it's a case of trial and error, making mistakes and getting plenty of tips and advice as well as not worrying too much if you lose a tree. This is only the second year I've been trying to grow Citrus and I managed to kill 2 trees in my first year. This year I managed to get the trees through the Winter and they are doing well so far this year.

I think the thing is to start small with basic varieties that are more hardy and learn and build it from there - nothing fancy. That's certainly my experience so far.

Happy hunting! Cross common nursery might be a good source if you can be bothered to go that far but Global Orange Groves is definately worth a visit and if nothing else for the interest, compost, feed and as a source of information.

I don't know about the growing medium "Citrus Compost" manufactured by Global Orange Groves, so I won't comment on that particular product. But I will say that every type of potting soil, no matter what ingredients it is made of, will preform fine for a short time. However, without some type of coarser ingredients such as barks, chips, or other chunks of some type, the medium graduly compacts with each watering, and problems always follows. This is particulary true of growing mediums that contain high amounts of peat moss. I have 73 trees in containers, and have been growing citrus for years, and can tell you that the quality of the medium that a containerized tree grows in, is of the most critical importance. - Millet

Thanks again Nick. We are die hards when it comes to radiators, we barely use them (three days in two rooms this year!) and we have a heat lamp to keep our cats comfortable when its bitter so until I get my garden I'll make whatever sacrifices to our comfort to get my new plant-babies through the year. I will definitely go to GOG though, those prices seem good and it would just me good to look anyway!

Millet, as always, your advice from such tremendous experience is taken on board re compost. What say you about varieties?

Millet - Is it worth re-potting just to freshen up the compost/soil every couple of years even if the tree and root ball doesn't strictly need it.

I've heard that 'compost' for other plants, not Citrus, needs refreshing in containers to help feed the plants. But as we feed Citrus regularly is this necessary.

This stuff from GOB is is pretty grainy/sand like in composition with a tiny bit of bark (but very little). It hasn't got peat but is similar in composition to loam based composts we can get here. It seems to drain well but retain enough for the tree to absorb what water and feed it needs.

It seems a pretty good mixture of the elements people here say you should have or avoid.

But it's great to know your experience as these nurseries are always able to create conditions better.

Thanks

Nick