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Tobacco and Nicotinoids

 
Citrus Growers Forum Index du Forum -> Citrus diseases and pests
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Cactusrequiem
Citruholic
Citruholic


Joined: 13 Nov 2005
Posts: 229
Location: North Charleston, SC

Posted: Sun 04 Jan, 2009 3:29 am

I have been doing some crazy research as of late and was wondering if anybody else had thought/tried this.
Imidacloprid is the active ingredient in Provado, Admire, Merit, Premise, and Bayer Shrub and Tree. It is known as a nicotinoid, or a derivative of the compound Nicotine.
I have found a recipe for homemade insecticide using tobacco.
Basically, One cup of Chewing Tobacco and one gallon of water. Let sit for 24 hours, strain and spray.
Any thoughts on good/bad idea to try?
If it works, it would be WAAYYY cheaper than any of the above listed chemicals.
Darren

And a FYI, As of the 2008 Florida Citrus Pest Management Guide, Imidacloprid has been suggested to be used to control, Aphids, CLM and Asian Citrus Psyllid. The last one being the reason Charleston is under a Citrus Quarantine right now.

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Malcolm_Manners
Citrus Guru
Citrus Guru


Joined: 13 Nov 2005
Posts: 676
Location: Lakeland Florida

Posted: Sun 04 Jan, 2009 1:29 pm

The reason tobacco "tea" sprays are not recommended is that nicotine is so very toxic to humans (LD50 = 50 mg/kg; compare imidacloprid at 450), and it is skin-absorbable, making it far more dangerous than any of the commonly used insecticides, except perhaps Temik, and we don't spray it. Chewing and smoking are doable without dying only because you're getting a very low dose of the nicotine in the process. But if you got an insecticidal spray on you, it could be much more dangerous. And because of all that, of course, nicotine is not labeled by the EPA, so its use is against federal law.
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Millet
Citruholic
Citruholic


Joined: 13 Nov 2005
Posts: 6657
Location: Colorado

Posted: Sun 04 Jan, 2009 4:48 pm

Nicotine, including tobacco leaves, has been banned for most uses, including all commercial and organic growing. Nonetheless, it's still sometimes used by growers and gardeners who think that because tobacco is a plant anything that come from it must be safe. This is, of course, a ridiculous assumption, especially considering the amount of lung cancer in the world. Nicotine is extremely toxic and has little place in conventional production because it is so poisonous. In fact, nicotine sulfate used to be one of the most toxic pesticides that was used, ranking very close to the synthetic pesticide aldicarb. Nicotine is a nerve toxin that acts very quickly, and along with humans nicotine is also very dangerous to a wide variety of animals. - Millet
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Cactusrequiem
Citruholic
Citruholic


Joined: 13 Nov 2005
Posts: 229
Location: North Charleston, SC

Posted: Sun 04 Jan, 2009 5:16 pm

I guess the saying don't believe everything you see on the internet IS true then.
Oh, well, guess I will have to bite the bullet and buy some Provado or something.
Darren

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Helix
Citruholic
Citruholic


Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Posts: 37
Location: Atwater CA

Posted: Sun 04 Jan, 2009 10:47 pm

The GIs in Vietnam used to put a tobacco pouch on their neck. With the high humididy and sweat the tobacco juice would run down their bodies and keep leeches off them.

Helix
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turtleman
Citrus Guru
Citrus Guru


Joined: 30 Nov 2008
Posts: 225
Location: Arizona

Posted: Sun 04 Jan, 2009 11:09 pm

I never did the tobacco, but I admit .. I wore panty hose.. Rolling Eyes
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Millet
Citruholic
Citruholic


Joined: 13 Nov 2005
Posts: 6657
Location: Colorado

Posted: Sun 04 Jan, 2009 11:58 pm

I was looking at the Integrated Pest Management (IPM) link on Wikipedia. Below was one of the recommendations. Notice: NICOTINE. Wikipedia needs to update their link to legal pesticides.

6. Chemical controls: Synthetic pesticides are generally only used as required and often only at specific times in a pests life cycle. Many of the newer pesticide groups are derived from plants or naturally occurring substances (e.g.: nicotine, pyrethrum and insect juvenile hormone analogues), and further 'biology-based' or 'ecological' techniques are under evaluation.

Millet
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Cactusrequiem
Citruholic
Citruholic


Joined: 13 Nov 2005
Posts: 229
Location: North Charleston, SC

Posted: Mon 05 Jan, 2009 12:56 am

That may have been one of the websites I saw Millet. I was reading so many different things bouncing back and forth between websites, I can't even find half of them now Embarassed
Darren

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snickles
Citrus Guru
Citrus Guru


Joined: 15 Dec 2005
Posts: 170
Location: San Joaquin Valley, Ca

Posted: Thu 08 Jan, 2009 4:07 pm

Nicotine sprays were used in Citrus years ago mainly for defense against scale but also for piercing, sucking insects.

Botanical Pest Controls

I am a little puzzled why anyone that is or will be concerned about Citrus Greening is not contemplating the use of it. May require a special Ag permit to spray nowadays on commercial groves but should be an effective preventative control spray for Asian Citrus Psyllid. Once your area is losing in ground, production trees to Citrus Greening, then I bet someone in your local state Ag Department will look into using Nicotine sulfate to use as a preventative or knock down spray again, no matter what the USDA has in mind due to EPA non-clearance.

I've sprayed Nicotine sulfate tanked mixed with water and horticultural oil years ago. I can tell you that wearing protective clothing is really all you need. Minute droplets on the skin can cause a burning effect, not a rash like some people that have never sprayed this chemical before want us to believe. Certainly Nicotine is not nearly as toxic to the skin or to human health as the old Parathion was in liquid form that was also used as a Citrus spray. A fumigant form of Nicotine is still being used in select greenhouses for non edible plants.

Jim
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