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Citrus Growers Forum
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Citrus Growers v2.0
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JoeReal Site Admin
Joined: 16 Nov 2005 Posts: 4726 Location: Davis, California
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Posted: Wed 09 Aug, 2006 11:03 am |
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I like to contribute insignificantly by:
Not using any bags if I can carry the items I bought from the stores.
All of my light bulbs that are over 4 watts are now compact flourescent.
All my yard lights are photocell controlled and motion sensor detect, so they really don't turn on when not needed.
My lawn mower is electric but the lawn has to go away if I get my way, but that would be city violation. All my other yard equipments are electric.
We open windows at night to let the cool delta breezes in. But of course we have security alarms if the screens are breached. We have thermal inertia from this cooling effect and most of the time our AC goes to work at around 3:00 pm instead of starting from 8:00 am, a savings of 6 hours AC usage each summer day, quite dramatic.
I plant citruses and those that are south of the house, I make them grow tall to cover our south facing wall, to block off unwanted sunshine and lighten AC load. Citruses also trap CO2 but emit much less smog causing complex hydrocarbons like other trees such as pines, gum trees and eucalyptus.
Avocadoes are also good CO2 trappers and do not emit smog causing chemicals.
I plant some temperate fruit plants in the west side of the house to provide great shade from the baking California afternoon sun during the summer, but during the winter they loose their leaves to help heat the house by letting the sunshine through.
I practice bark inversion on some of my mature trees. This has reduced the need for pruning, but increased fruit size and production. Without a lot of pruning, I help reduce yard waste and all the city's energy of processing them. This will also help reduce fertilizer consumption as there is not much to throw away, and so the trees will consume a lot less. Citruses are excellent, in that you really seldom need to prune them, and if you do prune them all the time, you will be at the losing end of your gardening.
I train my kids not to leave the lights, computers and TV on when no one's using them.
I now use charcoal as my major soil amendment to help forever trap carbon permanently. This should lessen my need for fertilizers as the charcoal will improve fertilizer use efficiency dramatically, reducing the need for oil-based resources when producing fertilizers.
In the very near future, I will install solar panels when their efficiency shoots up and costs go down, promising research and companies in the silicon valley are ramping up production.
I really love to use the new pluggable sports car that has a range of 250 miles per charge and can go from 0 to 60 mph in under 4 seconds. The cost is currently 6 figure price tag, but it could go down to less than 50K once these silicon valley companies take off. Google have invested heavily on these companies, too bad GM had their chances but never pursued this civilized approach. Prius are way uglier compared to these beautiful electric Tesla cars. Not to berate Prius, whose form and efficiency I like already. It is true that if we use the modern powerful and efficient electric cars, we may be only substituting one fossil energy source over another, but with solar grid, that should not be a problem. And also, one big advantage when it comes to pollution source, this now become a point source rather than distributed tail pipes, a lot easier to control and trap, and not to mention the increased overall efficiency of today's electric generation and motor technology.
And yes, even though the office is just 25 miles away, and the kids are 2 miles away from school, we participate in carpool.
We minimize grocery trips and use bicycles when possible.
I compost, I reuse, I recycle and there's a lot more that we can do to help conserve and make this planet habitable much longer.
Most of all planting your own fruit trees, especially citruses help a lot. These are food that won't require further processing, and you don't waste processing energy to enjoy them. |
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bencelest Citruholic
Joined: 13 Nov 2005 Posts: 1595 Location: Salinas, California
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Posted: Wed 09 Aug, 2006 5:29 pm |
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You have a lot of good point. I am interested buying a hybrid and I keep an eye on Prius but what is an alternative to it? You mentioned Tesla. I never heard of it. Please convince me. |
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JoeReal Site Admin
Joined: 16 Nov 2005 Posts: 4726 Location: Davis, California
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Posted: Wed 09 Aug, 2006 7:36 pm |
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Patty_in_wisc Citrus Angel
Joined: 15 Nov 2005 Posts: 1842 Location: zone 5 Milwaukee, Wi
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Posted: Wed 09 Aug, 2006 9:12 pm |
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Well, I compost all kitchen scraps to go back in garden. I think I'll have a wood burner from a friend to put in sunroom - there's already a chimney at back of house before I added on so won't have to worry about that. It should provide heat to kitchen too so I can close off that vent.
So, did anyone's zone change #'s? _________________ Patty
I drink wine to make other people more interesting
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Millet Citruholic
Joined: 13 Nov 2005 Posts: 6656 Location: Colorado
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Posted: Thu 10 Aug, 2006 1:15 am |
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I would never buy a hybrid car in order to save money on gas. At the current inflated price leves for hybrids, I could buy 17,000 gallons of gas at the $3.00 per gallon price. However, the thing that I really do not like about hybrid cars is the $3,000.00 tax incentive given to people who purchase them. Why should the government give people an incentive? That means everone else has to make up the difference. Let the hybrids stand on their own. - Millet |
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JoeReal Site Admin
Joined: 16 Nov 2005 Posts: 4726 Location: Davis, California
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Posted: Thu 10 Aug, 2006 1:29 am |
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Millet, will you be buying ZEV then, like the electric car when the price goes down? Currently the best one is at least $100K.
There is a flying car that gets 60 mpg, and goes 300 mph, but that one sells for $999,995.00 with a non-refundable deposit of $5,000 if you want to be the first one to receive them in 10 years, after the FAA have developed the highways in the sky.
Anyway, our zone haven't changed, it is still USDA zone 9 and Sunset Zone 14. Our winters became milder but not too mild to rob us off of chilling hours, and we just have slightly more rains when we are long overdue for drought, and more summer days with century mark temperatures. |
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Millet Citruholic
Joined: 13 Nov 2005 Posts: 6656 Location: Colorado
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Posted: Thu 10 Aug, 2006 4:52 am |
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Joe, I guess I will not be buying a ZEV as I do not know what it is. I am trading in my Corvette for the new one. Colorado was zone 5 when I was born, and it is still zone 5 today. Colorado winters are just as cold and they were 20 years ago. This summer has had fewer 90F+ days than last year. The world is not coming to an end. - Millet |
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JoeReal Site Admin
Joined: 16 Nov 2005 Posts: 4726 Location: Davis, California
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Posted: Thu 10 Aug, 2006 5:11 am |
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ZEV are zero emissions vehicle. It could be solar car, electric cars, or wind powered vehicles, cars driven by Flintstones as long as they don't pass gas, LOL.
Did you look at the links above to Tesla "Porche" equivalent ZEV? Truly a beaut and could zip as fast or faster, without the emissions and 250 mile range each charge.
The world is not coming to an end in our lifetime. Imagination is much more important than knowledge. |
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BabyBlue11371 Site Admin
Joined: 28 Nov 2005 Posts: 830 Location: SE Kansas
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Posted: Thu 10 Aug, 2006 6:01 am |
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I googled plant zones and came up wiht this website..
Real cool.. has links for plant zones all over. I listed the zones they cover at the bottom of this post.. the original page has those dang double underlined words (kinda anoying I think).. so I clicked a few links to post here..
Canada zone map...
http://atlas.nrcan.gc.ca/site/english/maps/environment/forest/forestcanada/planthardi
Enter your zip on this arborday page to get a zone.. *says mine is 6-7?? *
http://www.arborday.org/webtools/hortzones/ziplookup.cfm?RegID=473
Europe...
http://www.backyardgardener.com/zone/europezone.html
Australia..
http://www.anbg.gov.au/hort.research/zones.html
The link to the original page..
http://www.backyardgardener.com/zone/
Some of what is listed on that page....
United States, Canada & North America
USDA Hardiness Zone Map (requires a pop up) no ads
North America USDA Plant Hardiness Zone Map
Canada Plant Hardiness Zone Map
Europe
Europe Climate Zone Map
Hardiness Zone Map for Europe
Europa Hardiness Zone map - Shows East of Moscow
Australia
Australian Government Climate map
Plant Hardiness Zones for Australia
China
China Hardiness Zone Map
South America
South America Hardiness Zone Map
There is more to that page than that but I thought I'd just give the highlights in case you want to avoid the double underline words...
I'm zone 6 according to your link Patty.. I think I am same.. just not a or b or what ever..
Gina *BabyBlue* |
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garnetmoth Citruholic
Joined: 28 Nov 2005 Posts: 440 Location: Cincinnati, OH
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Posted: Thu 10 Aug, 2006 6:51 am |
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This has been interesting.
I harvest rainwater, want to build a passive solar house, dont run the AC too much, vermicompost, yard compost, and ive even been known to trash dive.
has the earth reached carrying capacity? I hope not. will the impending doom lead R&D to go nuts and save us all from smog, heat, suburbs, etc? I hope so. ignoring the very real changes across the world isnt going to make the future any more safe.
peace and love |
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Skeeter Moderator
Joined: 23 Jul 2006 Posts: 2218 Location: Pensacola, FL zone 9
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Posted: Thu 10 Aug, 2006 8:59 am |
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If I remember correctly, the glacial/interglacial cycles are 100,000 yrs of cold with 10-15,000 years of warm. The temperature cycles are associated with increasing CO2 during the warm periods and decreasing CO2 during the cold periods. To my knowledge, there is no widely accepted theory as to what causes the decrease in CO2 during the cold, although increased storms causing more iron input to the ocean, fueling algal blooms that sink to the bottom of the ocean is one idea being considered.
The current level of CO2 is slightly higher than past warm period levels but is increasing exponentially.
Another big unknown is what causes the switch back to cold. The best theory there is that when we warm up enough, the oceans get fresh enough, it stops the formation of deep ocean water. When that happens warm water sits on the surface, fueling increased evaporation, increased storms and precipitation, including snow and restarts the building of glaciers.
The changes in temperature and increasing storms areone thing, but the resulting disruptions in food supply could be much more difficult to deal with.
While the things that an individual can do seem small, when you multiply them by millions or even billions it begins to mount up. Changing one incandescent bulb to a small fluorescent bulb will keep over 400 pounds of CO2 out of the atmosphere in the lifetime of the bulb. Multiply that by a few billion and we may just postpone the next ice age a few years.
-- Skeeter |
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Patty_in_wisc Citrus Angel
Joined: 15 Nov 2005 Posts: 1842 Location: zone 5 Milwaukee, Wi
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Posted: Thu 10 Aug, 2006 9:48 am |
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Gina, I found that same plant zone map months ago when I was looking for the new one. It is very hard to read ..ex.. if you look in NW there is zone 7 next to zone 5 & no clear lines or details & tons of colorings swirling.. I gave up on it, & it is an old one from around '94. Even looking in my area, it is tough to see. It also still shows the zones A & B which don't exist anymore. The new hardiness zone(and all H. zones in past ) is taken from at LEAST the last ten yrs of AVERAGE lows in the areas. Some average lows have gone up, like Chicago. Maybe only a few degrees, but enough to put it in a diff. zone. I wouldn't worry as much as some of you are. I think the air is getting much better than when I was a kid. The south side used to stink real bad & doesn't anymore. Laws are strict on factories dumping waste now. Like someone said here, we will not be around to really see any changes in environment, so take it easy! I believe most of us are conserving to help our future though, I changed all my bulbs to flourescent & I am VERY well insulated etc. Just get rid of truck & bus exhaust...YUK!
And, if we can keep farmers from keeping their animals waste out of streams which go to rivers which go to lakes, that would REALLY help.
Garnet, what do you mean by "trash dive"? Is that going thru someone's garbage? I have done that too LOL. You should see the nice antique oak rockers I have from it...but it doesn't help in conserving our energy ... It just uses up my own LOL _________________ Patty
I drink wine to make other people more interesting
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Patty_in_wisc Citrus Angel
Joined: 15 Nov 2005 Posts: 1842 Location: zone 5 Milwaukee, Wi
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Posted: Thu 10 Aug, 2006 12:18 pm |
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How do I find out my sunset zone? _________________ Patty
I drink wine to make other people more interesting
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garnetmoth Citruholic
Joined: 28 Nov 2005 Posts: 440 Location: Cincinnati, OH
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Posted: Thu 10 Aug, 2006 5:21 pm |
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Patty-
It most definately does save energy. Whenever I go to my friend Amys house, its always trash day. Her neighbors all put good items on the side of the trashbin. Its not that easy here in TN, weve got person-tall rolly garbage cans and were supposed to put all the trash in them.
I got some items sitting in a clean cardboard box- lunchbag with tupperware (washed them all), a sack of mesquite chips for the grill, 4 huge binders were on the lawn (i dont need them but ill Goodwill them with my next trip), and a great 3-speed oscilating fan that is nice and quiet. It just needed the dust wiped off and the wire blade-cage has snaps for easy removal.
I may not have gone out soon to buy these same objects, but that I am reusing items that would have otherwise been trash IS saving energy. Thats why recycling "works"
Stuff takes energy to make, so whenever you reuse or recycle it, it doesnt have to be mined and manufactured.
I did go see "that global warming movie" and if you have any doubt or dont understand the science, it is interesting. I think it could have been more detailed. Carpool, planning multiple stops to save trips, using a fan if its under 90 degrees, turing the AC up to 80 and wearing boxers at home... there are 100s of little things that individuals can do. And, making some of our own food through growing it is a great way to start.
Heck, even opening your mind to the possibility is a good start. Im glad to see this thread being an exchange of thoughful info
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JoeReal Site Admin
Joined: 16 Nov 2005 Posts: 4726 Location: Davis, California
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Posted: Thu 10 Aug, 2006 8:14 pm |
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Nice thoughts, Garnetmoth. I would much prefer to reuse than recycle. Recycling uses energy also and that is why the US is a throw-away society because it makes more economic sense to import than to recycle. When something is driven by economics, the long term future, the morality, humanity and compassion are all thrown out. Economics will and always be equated to greed sans morality, it is the bottom line, nothing else matter in the corporate world. The reason why there are companies in the recycling, hybrid car production, hydrogen research, solar technologies, is still economics, the improvement of their own bottomlines, subsidized by various governments. For most of us hobbyists, the economics and bottomline is not the reason why we like what we do, and so we can understand the non-economic sides, but the longer term side of caring for our only habitable planet for now. |
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