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Laaz Site Owner
Joined: 12 Nov 2005 Posts: 5664 Location: Dorchester County, South Carolina
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Posted: Fri 28 Dec, 2012 2:20 am |
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Yes, you want to try & keep the trees dormant all winter. It doesn't take much of a warm up for the trees to break dormancy. If that happens you can can lose much of the next flush from dead wood if you get another freeze. _________________ Wal-Mart a great place to buy cheap plastic crap ! http://walmartwatch.com/ ...
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Tom Citruholic
Joined: 11 Nov 2008 Posts: 259 Location: Alabama [Central]
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Posted: Fri 28 Dec, 2012 2:36 am |
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Thanks ! _________________ Tom in central Alabama |
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cristofre Citruholic
Joined: 09 Mar 2010 Posts: 200 Location: Clayton, Georgia USA zone 7B/8A
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Posted: Fri 28 Dec, 2012 4:32 pm |
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Tom wrote: | Cristofre, Please clear up my misunderstanding. Are the mandarin more tolerant of the cold and unprotected or are they the satsuma with the greenhouse built around them ?
Thanks, Tom |
Sorry, I have FOUR mandarin trees altogether, (2) Owari Satsuma mandarins that are permanently planted in the greenhouse, and (2) unknown mandarin varieties that I grew from seeds from grocery store fruit that are planted outside unprotected except for being on the south side of the house and some leaf mulch.
My main reasoning for the greenhouse was that those satusuma trees cost me like $100 ! I'm simply afraid to "experiment" with them. (still the greenhouse I designed to be passively heated and the supplemental heat lamps only came on for a total of about 20 hours last winter. )
I'm not out anything if the two "free" trees get dead. These are my experimental trees. |
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Roberto Citruholic
Joined: 02 Jun 2009 Posts: 132 Location: Vienna/Austria
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Posted: Fri 28 Dec, 2012 8:22 pm |
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For me he is just a swindler. I have asked him about his hardy citrus and he had to admit that it was just Poncirus. Nothing else! Although in a documentary about his method (simply permaculture) which came on tv in Germany they showed oranges and lemons covered with ice. Pure swindle -or call it fraud! |
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Sanguinello Gest
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Posted: Fri 28 Dec, 2012 8:24 pm |
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Depends WHEN you asked him ...
At first he tried out Poncirus ... |
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Radoslav Moderator
Joined: 03 May 2008 Posts: 453 Location: Slovak Republic
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Posted: Sat 29 Dec, 2012 6:57 am |
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I think, that Roberto is right. You can cover plants with snow, but it doesn't work like Sanguinello think. It is nonsense.
I know places in Czech Republic, where they try to grow Poncirus and they are unsuccesfull with it , no matter how much snow they put on it during winter. |
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Sanguinello Gest
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Posted: Sat 29 Dec, 2012 7:19 am |
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Hahahaha ...
If they are unsuccessfull with Poncirus, then they are unsuccessfull with everything ...
Besides I said it is snowing and that snow covers all, not that they put snow on it ... |
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Radoslav Moderator
Joined: 03 May 2008 Posts: 453 Location: Slovak Republic
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Posted: Sat 29 Dec, 2012 7:51 am |
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Sanguinello wrote: | Hahahaha ...
If they are unsuccessfull with Poncirus, then they are unsuccessfull with everything ... |
Apples and pears are more hardy then poncirus - it is not only about lowest temperature, but also about all winter conditions and also how long and warm is spring weather etc.
BTW: All, what I saw in that short document mentioned above was, that he grows potatoes. Yes, potatoes are the basic plant in the most cold parts of my country - no need "permaculture miracle" to grow them in mountains
Sanguinello wrote: |
Besides I said it is snowing and that snow covers all, not that they put snow on it ... |
And Sanguinello can you explain to me difference of level of protection, if snow fall itself and in case that you put it on your plant with your own hands ?
And btw I was talking about part of Czech republic, where you have 1m of snow during nearly whole winter.
I have a strong feeling, that you like to present your theories and fantasies like facts sometime. |
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Radoslav Moderator
Joined: 03 May 2008 Posts: 453 Location: Slovak Republic
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Sanguinello Gest
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Posted: Sat 29 Dec, 2012 11:02 am |
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Ok, all the world admires the success of Sepp Holzer, just Robert and Radoslaw not ... |
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GregMartin Citruholic
Joined: 12 Jan 2011 Posts: 268 Location: southern Maine, zone 5/6
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Posted: Sat 29 Dec, 2012 2:01 pm |
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Ok guys, looks like you have to visit the farm and bring us back pictures
That or we need a south facing mountain with lots of snowfall...anyone have a ski resort? They can send some of their snow making onto the lemons and keep them buried with soft powder...just have to keep the skiers off that pile
Here in Maine we get lots of snow, but it is constantly melting and compacting throughout the winter. It can be very rough on small bushes...my young highbush blueberry branches kept breaking for their first couple of years due to the force of the snow pack compacting down on them. Once they got bigger and tougher they were ok. |
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Radoslav Moderator
Joined: 03 May 2008 Posts: 453 Location: Slovak Republic
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Posted: Sat 29 Dec, 2012 2:32 pm |
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It is all nonsense, for example fruits - once go through the frost and they are finished.
In zone 6 you need ultra early citrus variety - which will wake up very soon - I do not know how it is possible in place where, for example you have snow in april and then have to be ripe before first frost.
And the best part of the video above is - like there is symbiose with local nature everywhere, while face of country is totaly changed, with huge
manmade ponds etc. I really like this noninvasive agriculture. |
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Esmark78 Moderator
Joined: 30 Nov 2009 Posts: 69 Location: Copenhagen, Denmark Zone8
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Posted: Sat 29 Dec, 2012 4:01 pm |
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I do not belive that he is growing lemons in Austria. Austria which is colder than Denmark in winter. Even Ichang lemon is not possible there. |
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GregMartin Citruholic
Joined: 12 Jan 2011 Posts: 268 Location: southern Maine, zone 5/6
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Posted: Sat 29 Dec, 2012 11:47 pm |
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Radoslav wrote: |
It is all nonsense, for example fruits - once go through the frost and they are finished.
In zone 6 you need ultra early citrus variety - which will wake up very soon - I do not know how it is possible in place where, for example you have snow in april and then have to be ripe before first frost.
And the best part of the video above is - like there is symbiose with local nature everywhere, while face of country is totaly changed, with huge
manmade ponds etc. I really like this noninvasive agriculture. |
Excellent point about the ripening season...thank you!
As for the manmade ponds, though...if a beaver makes a pond it's natural, if we do it's not??? The bigger issues are those of erosion, fertilizer run off, soil building vs. degradation. Can high yeilds be had at a reasonable cost to the consumer while avoiding those issues...that's what needs to be demonstrated.
Mainly, though, I was just wondering if he might have some special citrus varieties that he'd bred....maybe it is just Poncirus? |
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Sanguinello Gest
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Posted: Sun 30 Dec, 2012 2:35 am |
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The point of permaculture is to grant a permanent harvest.
Conventional culture destroys the ground and makes a desert on the long run.
Sepp Holzer took a wood monoculture with a degraded soil (Podsole) and turned it into a rich garden with very good soil and exceptional harvests in an extreme bad climate and and an area where never before vegetables and fruits could have been harvested. |
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