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Citrus Growers Forum
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Citrus Growers v2.0
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Skeeter Moderator
Joined: 23 Jul 2006 Posts: 2218 Location: Pensacola, FL zone 9
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Posted: Wed 27 Feb, 2008 1:38 pm |
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PM was not working for me--here is my reply to your PM:
I have a Lisbon lemon. I think it and Eureka are considered true lemons. I believe Ponderosa is as well but it is large, I do not know about Sambo.
Meyer is a hybrid (grapefruit and something) but it has a lemon flavor when it is just turning from green to yellow and I have heard it is more cold hardy.
My tree is on the NE corner of the house (it would be better for cold protection on the South side), but the brick does retain some heat. For protection in the Jan mid 20s, I had it wrapped to the roof line with several layers, a kiddie pool full of water under it, and 2 strands of Christmas lights around the bottom. The part above the roof line (unwrapped) was defoliated but is putting out new growth now. I think it would have survived upper teens with out much damage. I have over a dozen varieties grafted onto the lemon and all made it without damage --including oranges, grapefruit, mandarins. _________________ Skeet
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Laaz Site Owner
Joined: 12 Nov 2005 Posts: 5679 Location: Dorchester County, South Carolina
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Posted: Wed 27 Feb, 2008 2:56 pm |
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Ponderosa is not a true lemon and either is Sanbokan. _________________ Wal-Mart a great place to buy cheap plastic crap ! http://walmartwatch.com/ ...
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JoeReal Site Admin
Joined: 16 Nov 2005 Posts: 4726 Location: Davis, California
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Posted: Wed 27 Feb, 2008 3:50 pm |
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The lemon itself is a hybrid between sour orange and a citron, and the sour orange is a hybrid of pummelo and mandarin.
So what's the definition of a true lemon? |
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Laaz Site Owner
Joined: 12 Nov 2005 Posts: 5679 Location: Dorchester County, South Carolina
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Posted: Wed 27 Feb, 2008 3:54 pm |
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Some lemons considered true are:
Eureka
Lisbon
Harvey
Bearss
These are the most common in the USA. There are quite a few other Italian varieties that are also considered true. _________________ Wal-Mart a great place to buy cheap plastic crap ! http://walmartwatch.com/ ...
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tolumnia Citruholic
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 157 Location: Gainesville FL Zone 8/9
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Posted: Thu 28 Feb, 2008 3:29 pm |
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I have a Bearss lemon that has made it through several freezes over the past 8 years. The top new growth had some damage this past January but the lower new growth looks fine. Last year I had quite a few fruits around a pound each.
My Meyer lemon (same age) growing right next to the Bearss had no cold damage this year. Both are loaded with flower buds. |
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gregn Citruholic
Joined: 15 Oct 2006 Posts: 236 Location: North Vancouver, BC, Canada
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Posted: Sat 08 Mar, 2008 6:47 pm |
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Bearss lemon?? Is that AKA Bearss Lime??? or are they different?
Joe, interesting note on the origin of the lemon! I didn't know that.
Greg _________________ Gregn, citrus enthusiast. North Vancouver Canada. USDA zone 8. I grow In-ground citrus, Palms and bananas. Also have container citrus |
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Laaz Site Owner
Joined: 12 Nov 2005 Posts: 5679 Location: Dorchester County, South Carolina
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Posted: Sat 08 Mar, 2008 7:39 pm |
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Greg have a look here. http://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/morton/lemon.html
Quote: | 'Bearss' ('Sicily', but not the original introduction by Gen. Sanford in 1875, which has disappeared)a seedling believed to have been planted in 1892, discovered in the Bearss grove near Lutz, Florida, about 1952. Closely resembles 'Lisbon'. It is highly susceptible to scab and greasy spot and oil spotting. The tree is vigorous and tends to produce too many water sprouts. Nevertheless, it has been propagated commercially by Libby, McNeill & Libby since 1953 because the peel is rich in oil. It constitutes 20% of Brazil's lemon/lime crop. , | _________________ Wal-Mart a great place to buy cheap plastic crap ! http://walmartwatch.com/ ...
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tolumnia Citruholic
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 157 Location: Gainesville FL Zone 8/9
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Posted: Thu 13 Mar, 2008 7:04 pm |
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Laaz,
Is that ever right about water sprouts! Loads of them. I have been pruning the tree lately, still need to cut off a few sprouts. |
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Laaz Site Owner
Joined: 12 Nov 2005 Posts: 5679 Location: Dorchester County, South Carolina
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Posted: Thu 13 Mar, 2008 7:47 pm |
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tolumnia yes mine has many sprouts, but they all produce fruit in time. You know I forgot all about my Bearss lemon all winter. It never had any protection & saw a low of 24 F in a 20 gal pot on my back deck. I just went out and checked & it is flushing & budding out. Lost some leaves, but looks to be in great shape with no dead wood. May have to put this one in the ground this year. I'll get some pics this weekend. _________________ Wal-Mart a great place to buy cheap plastic crap ! http://walmartwatch.com/ ...
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tolumnia Citruholic
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 157 Location: Gainesville FL Zone 8/9
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Posted: Fri 14 Mar, 2008 4:02 pm |
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My problem is that the remaining sprouts are so tall that they are shading other trees too much. The tops of the tall sprouts were killed back about three feet in the last freeze, but the lower branches are fine. Also, way too tall to easily harvest any fruit. |
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Steve Citruholic
Joined: 10 Sep 2007 Posts: 253 Location: Southern Germany
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Posted: Sat 15 Mar, 2008 7:07 am |
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JoeReal wrote: | The lemon itself is a hybrid between sour orange and a citron, and the sour orange is a hybrid of pummelo and mandarin.
So what's the definition of a true lemon? |
Well, a true lemon is a true lemon Kidding...
Joe, true lemons a lemons which had no man made improvements, like hybrids done in the 60tys or 70tys with citrons to improve their ability to widstand mal secco.... So there a many of those hybrids now around, but none of them matches the taste and fruit of a old style lemon.
Other hybrids, like Ponderosa, Lipo, Sanbokan or other are crosses with Citrus maxima or Citrus paradisi and are usually made to improve the fruit size or serve for ornamental demands....
Except Citrus maxima, Citrus reticulata and Citrus medica all other citrus fruits are hybrids. Except maybe some were seldom found species, like the Tachibana and the Halimi, or some of the papeda group.
So a lemon is, like the lime, a natural cross of Citrus maxima, Citrus medica and third one, maybe Microcitrus sp. but the last is rather speculative...
So a Lemon isn't a cross of sour orange and citron. That's what many guess, but it's not! We can't consider today the parentage of those natural hybrids, because even with best DNA analysis we only can find the genes of the parent types, but the true parentage is still unknown and speculative. So, maybe the lemon is a Citron x Citron cross, which formed juice fruits, and this hybrid came in merge with a Pumelo x Microcitrus hybrid? Who knows? None!
So get rid of this thinking of the crosses...
Natural lemons are the lemons, which were show in genetical analytics the typical lemon patterns, and further improvements, well, today we can still find them, so we can see if it's a true lemon, the typical natural hybrid, or a modern cross, beceuse the typical genom pattern of the natural hybrid has changed again....
That, Joe, is confusing, but simple let it go! Eureka, Lisbon, Villafranka, Sicilian (Bears), Verna, Lunario and some other can be considered as true... _________________ Eerh, hmm, uuuh, oooh, just guessing |
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