When should I start procedures to force the fall buds that I grafted. Obviously the trees should not start growing for at least 2 or 3 months, but would it be OK to start tying limb tips downward so that the buds will not be inhibited when growing starts?

Of the 3 methods, inverting the tip, breaking , or notching-- Does anyone have a preference?

Thanks-- Skeet

I do the lazy man's approach. I simply nip off the stem as soon as min air temp consistently goes above 30 deg F in the forecast.

Skeeter, If the trees are in a dormant state, I wait until around our last frost free date. Here that is around the end of February. If the stem is thin, and can be bent, I do that, tying it to itself. If the stem is too stiff, I put a 4" cable tie about an inch above the new bud, and then break the stem. The cable tie keeps the break from extending into the bud area. If the rootstock is large, you may have no choice but cut it off.

One reason I like to bend the rootstock, as opposed to cutting it off, is that, should the bud fail, I can quickly rebud. Also, the bent top is supposed to provide nureshment to the new bud. I have often wondered how the pros fall out on this. The one big nursery I have been to bent the stems. Of course, all of their rootstock was of a uniform size, which made bending easy.

It would be interesting to know how Buddingman handles this.

If in case it did not sprout, It is always better for me to cut off that whole branch and start on others. There are places to find. But if I were to do it on seedling rootstock, I can't take chances of nipping it off. Bending would be preferrable. But for existing trees, like my multi-grafted trees, it doesn't really matter. If it didn't sprout, too bad for the new cultivar, I'll just use other branches. Surprisingly, those dormant ones that I left alone sometimes would spring anew after 2-3 years. Usually almost all of them would sprout. I have about 5% that didn't sprout, and not worth the effort of bending and then coming back to regraft or nip off.

Thanks Ned and Joe.

Our last frost should be in Feb and all of my grafts are on multi variety trees-- most on that Lisbon that grew 4 ft last yr-- So I may take the lazy way on most, but try the bending/breaking just to see if I tell any difference in growth.

Skeet

Actually, I do about the same thing. If budding/grafting to a established tree, I would just cut the limb off myself.

I have been trying notching above the grafts but I think my notching is not deep enough. I don't recall where I read to notch above the graft and I don't recall that it said how far to notch in to the tree. I notched through the bark and half again that much into the wood..
Anyone else use this method??
It is kinda frustrating I have 8 buds that are still green and none have started growing yet since I budded them back in August.
In retrospect I would not have grafted the locations I did but they are there now and I can't change that.. They are on the trunks of other trees. So I can't just loop off above the graft or bend/break it to force with out loosing the existing trees.. I had to trim back the bark because it was starting to grow over the buds.. most of the buds are plump like they will start growing any moment but they have been like that since I notched them a couple months back... I just took some pics So I will post pics to my thread about my buds as soon as I get the pics edited..

Glad to see this post Skeet!!

Gina *BabyBlue*

Still just thinking ahead, but should I prune some of the adjacent branches when the bud shoots start growing. Some of my buds are kind of back in the canopy and will be hidden by some of the other branches.

Also, I have a couple places where I have 2 or 3 buds on one limb, how do you handle that-- will both grow when the end is cut off?

Skeet

I remember reading a research paper by a Kim Bowman (a google may find the reference) about this. The conclusion was that bending and tying the tops was the best method to get a quick strong burst of growth from the bud. Better than breaking the top over. But of-course this was a comparison between well-grown commercial rootstocks of uniform size, budded with nice fat buds from good budwood.
I usually have less than perfect budwood, and far from perfect rootstocks. I've got several buddings from unusual varieties that have done nothing for a complete year or even more. I've tried bending, breaking, notching and nothing works. New shoots grow from the rootstock, but the bud just sits and sulks.

I run into the same problem. After the fact, I think that maybe I used a blind (without a bud eye) bud. I try to be careful and select good buds, but the problem still pops up at times. Still, this is a good time to point out that the first few nodes on a citrus stem have no buds and will not sprout.

I went ahead and started forcing one bud today-- it was a Daisy Mandarin on a trifoliate sprout from one of my satsumas. The trifoliate was starting to flush, so I went ahead and cut the top off. The 10 day forecast has lows in the 40's and 50's with the lowest temp forecast at 45. That will put us into the first week of March-- I know it could still freeze, but the odds are getting slim!

When the understock start terminal growth the plant is lopped off 3 or 4 inches above the bud.

After the bud has made 4 or 5 inches of growth the top is lopped of at about a 45 degree andlge with the bud on the high side.

Bonnie, in the above post you said, ...."When the understock start terminal growth the plant is lopped off 3 or 4 inches above the bud."....

My question is, -- When you leave the 3 or 4 inches above the bud that you wish to force, are you leaving all the leaves that might be growing in that 3 to 4 inch space?

Millet
Carl Linnaeus 1707 - 1778
300th Anniversary

YEAH!--Less than 1 week after cutting the top off, my buds have started growing. I had 2 Daisy buds on the same trifoliate sprout and both of them are already starting to grow. My first sucessful budding all the way to getting the new bud started growing.

I cut the tops off on several limbs of my Lisbon lemon yesterday to start forcing some of those buds. There are a couple limbs that I am trying the "tie down" method on because the tips of those limbs are loaded with blooms and I am yet to get any lemons from the tree. I am currently forcing Hamlin, Star Ruby, Calamondin, Ruby Red and Meyer Lemons.