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brianPA2 Citruholic
Joined: 09 Mar 2013 Posts: 119 Location: Southeastern Pennsylvania (6b)
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Posted: Mon 10 Mar, 2014 6:21 pm |
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What's the difference betwen rot caused by phytophthora versus general poor drainage? Is it just cell death from lack of oxygen and not fungal at all? |
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Sludge Citruholic
Joined: 16 Mar 2009 Posts: 55 Location: Northern California
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Posted: Tue 11 Mar, 2014 3:04 pm |
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Millet wrote: | I would like to respond at a greater length to this tree's problem, but don't have time at present. A quick comment about the tree's rootstock, which Sludge reported the rootstock to be C-35. C-35 is a good root stock and is rated as being highly tolerant to phytophthora foot and root rot. I believe ithe problem was the medium the tree was planted it. - Millet |
I don't see how it could be the medium, I've used the 3 perlite - 1 pine bark - 1 peat moss in all my citrus pots, and they've all thrived in it, even seedling plants. About the only things different this batch were a I switched the brands of perlite and peat moss I used, and I added a handful of compost. |
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Millet Citruholic
Joined: 13 Nov 2005 Posts: 6657 Location: Colorado
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Posted: Tue 11 Mar, 2014 6:09 pm |
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A planting medium should always be made using ingredients of difference size. If bark is used, it should be 3/4 to 1 inch in size. Particle size is an important factor in selecting bark for a growth medium. The finer the particle size, the more the particles fit together and reduce aeration while increasing water hold capacity. In addition, finer particles decompose more quickly than more coarse particles. Perlite purchased in retail nurseries is really bad stuff. Pour some out of the bag an look at it. It ranges all the way from a few 1/4 inch pieces down to 1/8 inch then and all the way to almost the size of granulated sugar. When a range of SMALL particle sizes are present, the finer particles fit in among the larger particles and compact, again forming very poorly aerated conditions to the point of restricting water movement. When perlite and bark fines fill in the open spaces of the medium, it leaves few areas for needed air pockets. A good growth medium should contain between 30 to 50 percent aeration. Commercially, the number one growth medium used world wide is 3 parts bark, 1 part peat and 1 part graded 1/8 inch sand. Sand that is of a consistent particle size will not pack - Millet |
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Sludge Citruholic
Joined: 16 Mar 2009 Posts: 55 Location: Northern California
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Posted: Tue 11 Mar, 2014 9:38 pm |
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Hmm... I did notice that the new brand perlite that I bought had a fair amount of smaller material in it compared with the last brand I used. The previous stuff had smaller materiel in it, but most of it was of a fairly consistent size (about pea sized). However, the medium didn't seem too packed when I de-potted the lemon, but I suppose it's a possibility.
I'll have to sift the perlite before I make a new batch and see if this problem ever repeats. |
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Millet Citruholic
Joined: 13 Nov 2005 Posts: 6657 Location: Colorado
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Posted: Tue 11 Mar, 2014 11:04 pm |
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The worst perlite I have ever come across was sold by Schultz Lawn & Garden Company. Regrettably, Schultz is a nation wide supplier. - Millet |
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Sludge Citruholic
Joined: 16 Mar 2009 Posts: 55 Location: Northern California
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Posted: Wed 12 Mar, 2014 2:22 pm |
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Haven't gotten Schultz. The old stuff I was using was NorCal perlite, and the new stuff was... I think Aztec? It was in a paper bag and I store it outdoors, so I ended up transferring it into the old bag (which is why I know what the previous brand was and not the new one).
Anyway, it looks like they don't have a screening for too fine perlite, just too large chunks. It's dusty enough that I wear a dust mask and goggles when working with it straight from the bag. |
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babranch Citruholic
Joined: 06 Jan 2013 Posts: 42 Location: Manor, Georgia
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Posted: Wed 12 Mar, 2014 5:59 pm |
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When I get large bags of horticultural grade perlite there are still some small particles that are sugar grain sized and smaller. I end up dumping the bag into a trash can that has 1/8" holes drilled into the sides and bottom and I rinse the perlite with water to try to wash the small stuff out. This perlite comes from a horticultural supply store in a 4 cu ft bag. |
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brianPA2 Citruholic
Joined: 09 Mar 2013 Posts: 119 Location: Southeastern Pennsylvania (6b)
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Posted: Thu 13 Mar, 2014 1:15 pm |
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Millet is this why you no longer recommend perlite in potting mixes - because the perlite available is junk? It seems like a useful addition, I always wondered why it fell out of favor. Does seem to clog the root pruning holes in my air pot, though. |
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