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How do you know which seedlings to keep? (Chance Seedling)

 
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Mark_T
Citruholic
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Joined: 30 Jun 2009
Posts: 757
Location: Gilbert,AZ

Posted: Tue 29 Sep, 2009 2:43 am

For all you experts, lets say you grow 10 to 12 seedling of a given variety. Mandarin,Orange, store bought lemon, lime...

You see to or three that are much more vigorous than the others and you decide to nurse those. Then there are the left overs, some seem dwarfish pathetic, others lifeless sort of nothing, but still a viable plant. How do you pick from a batch of seedlings, if at all, to maybe shoot for that chance seedling? I've started growing from seed and want to come away with with several good specimans of the variety. But what about the freaks? Is there anything to look for when deciding which seedling could be unique? How long is long enough to wait?
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citrange
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Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 590
Location: UK - 15 miles west of London

Posted: Tue 29 Sep, 2009 4:44 pm

If you're looking for a unique new variety which is commercially viable, how about 20 years minimum? Which means, if you're as old as me, you could be fertilising the tree from underneath!!
Grow to first fruit. Continue to more mature tree, as first fruits aren't typical. Compare with other varieties - is it really an improvement. Check how easy to propagate and which rootstocks are suitable. Grow in different climates and soils. Research disease susceptability.
If you just want to see if it's a bit different from the parents, you still need to wait for fruit. Usually about 5 to 15 years depending on climate and luck.

To return to your post. If you are growing a variety that doen't 'come true', then the most vigorous seedlings are often the result of cross-pollination. Uniform seedlings are the clones. I suppose a different leaf-shape is the only other clue.

Quote:
lifeless sort of nothing, but still a viable plant
seems a bit of a contradiction!
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Sylvain
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Joined: 16 Nov 2007
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Location: Bergerac, France.

Posted: Tue 29 Sep, 2009 6:33 pm

You meant "least vigorous seedling" I presume.

Sylvain.
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Mark_T
Citruholic
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Location: Gilbert,AZ

Posted: Tue 29 Sep, 2009 6:34 pm

Thanks for the insight. On the last part, I meant the seedlings that really don't get your attention one way or another.

I'm really looking for the best way to choose the seedlings for the type I'm growing and perhaps know what to look for in a freak, something that may be notable or fun to grow for other reasons. So it's really two fold.

I've been thinking a lot about all those seeds in the fruit we eat every day. How many of them are new breeds or mutations just waiting to be found, that just wind up in the trash?
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citrange
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Joined: 24 Nov 2005
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Location: UK - 15 miles west of London

Posted: Tue 29 Sep, 2009 8:25 pm

Quote:
I've been thinking a lot about all those seeds in the fruit we eat every day. How many of them are new breeds or mutations just waiting to be found, that just wind up in the trash?

I do understand exactly what you mean, but really it's pointless thinking like that. There are billions and billions of seeds of all species that never germinate for whatever reason. Yes, any one of them may have been a fantastic new plant. But, you have to think of the practicalities of how many can anyone actually grow and test in a reasonable time. Not very many!
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fofoca
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Joined: 24 Jun 2009
Posts: 97
Location: SF Bay Area, California

Posted: Tue 29 Sep, 2009 11:17 pm

How about a middle-of-the-road approach? Grow them until you get sick of taking care of 10 trees and decide to get rid of the least productive/interesting. Sometimes nature will intervene if you have more trees than you can care for. And finally, if you do these experiments frequently, you will eventually run out of space and have to start cutting back to make room for new plants.

This has always worked for me!
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Mark_T
Citruholic
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Joined: 30 Jun 2009
Posts: 757
Location: Gilbert,AZ

Posted: Wed 30 Sep, 2009 1:34 am

fofoca wrote:
How about a middle-of-the-road approach? Grow them until you get sick of taking care of 10 trees and decide to get rid of the least productive/interesting. Sometimes nature will intervene if you have more trees than you can care for. And finally, if you do these experiments frequently, you will eventually run out of space and have to start cutting back to make room for new plants.

This has always worked for me!


Hey, as long as I'm not alone. I'm developing a sickness.
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citrange
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Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 590
Location: UK - 15 miles west of London

Posted: Wed 30 Sep, 2009 7:23 am

Quote:
You meant "least vigorous seedling" I presume.

Sylvain
No, actually I did mean most vigorous. I was thinking of citranges and citrumelos which are more vigorous than the parents and, if you look up the history, you will find that many were selected from other seedlings on this basis.
But you were right to correct me, because hybrids are completely variable. They can be more or less vigorous than the parents, or exactly the same. Another reason why you can often not distinguish the hybrid plants until fruiting maturity.
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Sylvain
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Joined: 16 Nov 2007
Posts: 790
Location: Bergerac, France.

Posted: Wed 30 Sep, 2009 11:09 am

OK.
I just asked because zygotic embryos are said to be four weeks late beside nucellar embryos though giving smaller seedling. But indeed this is only true for the beginning of the germination. Later they can be stronger or weaker depending on the cross.
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